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November 25, 2012
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Barbarella by Atlantean6 Barbarella by Atlantean6
Barbarella is at a bus stop, waiting for the early morning bus so she can get to her ship. This is not Jane Fonda, but then again, this Barbarella is no communist. A barbarian in the extreme, communism is beyond her.

This is my response for :iconsimonjm: 's fantasy piece, found here: [link] .

Rendered in DS4P, with UE2! No post work!
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dannysuling Featured By Owner Dec 20, 2012  Hobbyist General Artist
Actually, to barbarians, communism (as opposed to Communism) would feel quite sympatico as a life-style. You know, the all-for-one, one-for-all ethos by which hunter-gatherer societies lived. Let's not dismiss communism as a philosophy so easily. After all, there's never been a truly communist society in the history of the world.

Also, it's worth remembering that "barbarian" was a term employed exclusively by Roman society (already sinking from the demise of the Republic into dictatorship) to demean and debase people who were different from them and whose lives they didn't understand. And also, remember, the barbarians eventually won....

And as for Jane...well, she's done many things in her life (including her Barbarella, pre-Hanoi-Jane days), and she has my admiration, if not yours. We're all free to choose our sides, after all. And, let's not forget that she's lived and supported the capitalist's dream: as a successful entrepreneur, innovator, and salesperson. I mean, how much more do you want someone to do to live your preferred philosophy before you cut her some slack?

It's pretty clear, of course, that this babe ain't Jane. Bigger boobs, surlier face, more exotic features. But, then, I wonder if she's got the acting talent to match up?
Atlantean6 Featured By Owner Dec 21, 2012
I'll reply with a question. Do you believe that they who want to impose Communism on us have the moral right to do so? I just want to know where you stand.
dannysuling Featured By Owner Dec 21, 2012  Hobbyist General Artist
Far be it from me to engage in a political argument here at dA. Couldn't be a worse, more inappropriate venue. So, even though I think my direct answer to your question would surprise you, I'm really not going to respond with a direct answer. But the real reason I won't answer your question is that it's rhetorical--it presupposes the correct response, making the world black and white and forcing people to their knees, at your mercy.

I don't play that game...and you shouldn't either. The world isn't black and white, and there isn't "an answer," and one person's freedom is another person's chains.

And more than that, your asking that question suggests a lack of delicacy and respect for others' opinions--and not just my own. Which of course you have no inkling of, because you don't know me, have never conversed with me, and so seem to feel that you can prejudge me on the basis of an innocuous reply to a statement you posted in dA.

But, more important, it's worth noting that you phrased your question not as a political one but a moral one. This transformation from a discussion about political philosophy to a challenge about what is and is not "moral" isn't really worth the paper it's printed on. Obviously, an answer depends a great deal on whose morality we're talking about. In the history of the world, most of the carnage has been the result of one side trying to "impose" (I believe that's the word you used) its morality on the other side, often clothed in the guise of political differences.

Again, let me simply remind you that "Communism" and "communism" are not anywhere near equivalent. Except as a political theory, "communism" has never existed in reality anywhere, at any time. "Communism," on the other hand, was simply another name for a particular and pernicious kind of absolute dictatorship, one that threatened not just the West's political democracies but, because of the nuclear arms race it prompted, the existence of the entire planet.

It's worth your remembering, however, that Soviet Russia and the Red Army saved our butts in World War II, by sacrificing millions of its soldiers in a last-ditch, desperate attempt to fight off the Nazi invasion. And they succeeded, weakening the Reich to the point where Hitler no longer had the resources to defeat the Allied invasion of Normandy a year or so later. Do you think the Russian soldiers in the fight for Stalingrad cared a shit about whether Communism, Nazism, or Democracy ought to be the political system of choice? Do you believe that they were fighting because they were horrified at the existence of a "Final Solution" responsible for killing 10 million Europeans, including 6 million Jews? Nah! They were defending their families and their homes--the most important things in the world, because they loved them.

Keep in mind, too, that in any of the world's global conflicts, the US has never been invaded, never suffered its population to be shredded by a conquering army. What does the US know of what invasion does to people, to a country, to a belief system? Yeah, sure, the Civil War gave everyone a taste, but not of modern warfare. And, sure, Pearl Harbor and all that. And 911 and all that, too. But remember, the US is the one who dropped the Bomb--twice--on innocents, not just on military targets. How many did we kill?

I suppose it would be unfair of me to talk about gun laws in the US, and a health care system that makes it impossible for people to get the mental health attention they so desperately need, and how that combination has been so lethal to so many young innocents in US schools. Do you think those 6-year-olds in Connecticut gave a shit about Democracy, Capitalism, Communism, or Socialism? Do you think they and their parents might have benefitted from better gun control and better systems of mental health? Yeah, I know, that's hitting below the belt. I'm sorry.

But don't give any of us any crap about who's more moral. Morality is just another word for power. Give us an argument instead for a system of laws that are humane, fairly and justly administered, and supported by the entire population in exactly the same way, and then it doesn't matter at all what name you give to the political system--or the economic system, for that matter.

So, not an answer to your question, but then the question itself, as I said, presupposes its answer, so you already have the answer you need. Right?

I would recommend that you save your political (self) righteousness and redirect it away from dA and instead move it into forums on the Web where people mess with these issues. See how far you get. One way or another, perhaps you'll learn something, and so will the people you end up arguing with.
Atlantean6 Featured By Owner Dec 22, 2012
All I asked if you believed that we should be ruled by a few or by ourselves. :) When you said barbarians tended to do communism, I don't think a barbarian society will try it; especially a society of raiders. The pilgrims tried communism, and they found it didn't work.

( [link] ) and ( [link] ) for examples of barbarians. The Invasions of Indo-Europeans into India were done by people looking for land or for something else.

But through out history, you see this as the big question of political struggle. Do a few people have the right to rule over many? You see many migrations of people heading west throughout history seeking land and the right to rule themselves as to how they see fit. But yes, it's a personal question. But since you see it as political, this is the big question today. Should the American people give up our Constitution and allow themselves to be ruled by a few people in a dictatorship; or should they continue to honor the document and rule ourselves as a Republic under Law?

I considered about asking the question on the Radical Left websites for three minutes, to see what answer I'd get. However, the question should be posed to the Democratic National Convention or to the third political party, our Mainstream Media. Should we elect leaders who want to turn our government into one ruled by a few, or should we elect leaders that will allow us to continue to rule by the people and for people?
dannysuling Featured By Owner Dec 22, 2012  Hobbyist General Artist
This has got to be one of those times when the old adage, "I may not agree with what you say but respect your right to say it," will have to apply. As I noted previously, I am not going to get into a political discussion with you here on dA. It's inappropriate, unless it's specifically about art.

I'll simply say that it's important, when discussing history, to know how to assess and distinguish fact from fiction, and to be able to free yourself from both conspiracy theories and stereotypes when you're talking about real human beings. Radical Right and Radical Left have basically no interest for me in any discussion, except as straw men easily dispensed with by people of good will in complex discussions.

Let's move on, please, and save the politics for other times, other places.
Atlantean6 Featured By Owner Dec 23, 2012
Very well. Oh, for invasion of the U.S.A. It's true that the mainland hasn't suffered a formal invasion since the Revolutionary War. But don't get too proud and think it won't happen.
dannysuling Featured By Owner Dec 23, 2012  Hobbyist General Artist
Me? Proud? That piece of data was not crowing, it was a gentle chastisement. We've all been extraordinarily lucky, it seems to me. As for whether it could happen now? Well, I suppose anything is possible. But I'm wondering who the invader would be, in order to be successful. All our organized enemies are also our friends; and our disorganized enemies, like terrorists, could certainly inflict a lot of damage (so they've proven), but I can't see an INVASION. Won't happen.

Anyway, my sense is that we'd be better all the way around if we wouldn't let fear drive us. Use common sense, be alert, but watch out for hatred--especially that which surfaces from within.

On, now, to other things.
orchid22 Featured By Owner Nov 28, 2012
Great pose on her. She has a stern look on her face which suits your character. Well done.
Atlantean6 Featured By Owner Nov 29, 2012
Thank you! :)
orchid22 Featured By Owner Nov 29, 2012
My pleasure. I really am enjoying the battle
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